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drmoonstone
New Member
USA
14 Posts |
 Posted - Mar 04 2010 : 03:09:30
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What grade is a Chalin that has 4 swallows on the table?
Doc |
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Geoffroy
Moderator
USA
704 Posts |
Posted - Mar 04 2010 : 10:34:06
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It is an indication for the grade, I have seen from 2 to 5, Stars rabbits, wildboars, sparrows... , and since the figures changed in the time it could help to figure out the time, beside the serial number. My knowledge is very limited.
Darnation |
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dcronn
Junior Member
USA
59 Posts |
Posted - Mar 04 2010 : 14:07:57
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drmoonstone,
Check the 7th listing from the bottom of page 2. In a reply to Colin, patrickc of France discusses markings. Perhaps you could e-mail him.Seems worth a shot.
Dave C. |
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drmoonstone
New Member
USA
14 Posts |
Posted - Mar 04 2010 : 15:06:49
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Thanks for your response. I've enjoy the Forum very much and look forward to each new post. Serial number is 26961 (16 ga), 2.5 in. chamber opened to 2.75 with no restamp, each barrel has a 17.0 stamp, three proof marks and double crowns over PT and G55? on the mono block. Engraving is worn (gun about 70% condition) and has two dogs on left side with game birds , right side has two dogs (one bird in mouth of dog) and birds on each side of the T. Chokes appear to be full and 1/2 full as best as my eyes can tell. Just heading out to get a stronger magnifier so I can read the signatures on the receiver.
This is going to be a field gun so I won't be doing much restoration.
This whole darne thing started with a spur of the moment purchase of an R-15 Darne 12 ga. Then an r-15 20 ga. (both Darnes go 90-95%). Now the Charlin, another spur of the moment purchase. What can a man say, just got seduced by the beauty and function of these pieces of art and history.
I will check out the reference Dave gave me.
Thanks
Doc |
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Geoffroy
Moderator
USA
704 Posts |
Posted - Mar 05 2010 : 00:48:24
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I believe... that the 4 sparrows is the top and there is no 5 sparrow, that from gathering informations here and there. The sparrow were in use after the war for sure. And this gun is before or very early 1950s.
Darnation |
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drmoonstone
New Member
USA
14 Posts |
Posted - Mar 07 2010 : 16:30:09
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Thanks Geoffroy. Enjoyed talking with you.
Doc |
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patrickc
Junior Member
France
28 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2010 : 03:26:06
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drmoonstone,
I'm sorry to answer so late but I am very little connected to internet.
First we count the number of symbol per barrel. In your case if 4 swallows on the table then how many symbol barrels 2 or 4?
Thank you for your response
Patrick |
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patrickc
Junior Member
France
28 Posts |
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Colin
Junior Member
USA
65 Posts |
Posted - Mar 25 2010 : 15:23:06
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Thanks, Partickc for posting the article by J-C Mournetas on the Charlin. It has at least started to unravel the puzzle of the various Charlin Automatique grades and their markings. I have posted here some of the information from this article.
The successive models were asisgned letters from A through K. I and J were not used. K was used exclusively for highly customized weapons including those for competition shooting and those given to dignitaries or persons honored by the French Republic. Each model, and thus each letter, is assigned a certain animal whose symbol is stamped on the underside of each barrel and on the forend iron: rabbit, hare (how do these symbols differ?), swallow, tiger head, pigeon and star. Apparently over time there were some changes in the list of animals; the swallow might have been dropped after WW II, and at one time boars and pigeons were used. The quality of the finish is shown by the number of animal stamps; from one to eight. Some models were evidently never made in the higher grades: Geoffroy says he's never seen a swallow with more than 4 stamps. The Model K, however, has 10 stamps, because of its elite status. Following World War II appeared the model Grand-Chasse, which replace the basic model, and the models Diane, Sologne and Littoral. The Littoral has an anti-rust treatment on the metal surfaces which resists sea water. Although not stated, the system of indicating models by letter was probably superceded by model names. Charlin closed in 1972.
Anyone who can improve on my extract of this article or can furnish further information is certainly welcome to do so.
Certain questions still remain:
1. I have a Charlin which dates from the period between the two world wars. I can find no letter on it anywhere. Is the letter stamped on the weapon to indicate the model?
2. I understand that the more animal stampings, the higher the grade of the gun. However I don't understand what the various animals signify. Do some symbols indicate a higher grade of weapon? Or were the animals supposed to indicate the suitability of the weapon for that game? But the tiger and the star are hard to see as shotgun targets. Or do the symbols have some other meaning? There's a lot I still don't know about the Charlin marking system. |
Edited by - Colin on Mar 25 2010 15:26:36 |
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drmoonstone
New Member
USA
14 Posts |
Posted - Mar 25 2010 : 22:45:03
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Thanks for the info. Paid too much, still in love with it. Four Sparrows per. some modification has been done to gun that can be reversed (after talking to Simmons). I am currently looking for decent R15 or better 28.
Still gathering info on the Charlin but it is beginning to accumulate.
Doc |
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Colin
Junior Member
USA
65 Posts |
Posted - Mar 26 2010 : 01:34:20
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| Please post anything you find. Despite much help from Geoffroy, I'm still scratching my head over mine. According to the article posted by patrickc, the most common choke is full and modified. No wonder I can't hit anything with mine. |
Edited by - Colin on Mar 26 2010 01:36:20 |
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dcronn
Junior Member
USA
59 Posts |
Posted - Mar 26 2010 : 11:42:38
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Colin,
Try to find some polywad Spred-R loads or the newer doublewides. I've used the Spred-R shells for years grouse hunting and really like them. I've not tried the others, but have read good reviews.
Dave C. |
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drmoonstone
New Member
USA
14 Posts |
Posted - Mar 31 2010 : 19:12:21
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Finally was able to get enough magnification to read the engravers signature on my Charlin. So my efforts to learn all I can are progressing.
Took an old 20 power scope (bent and unusable) that I got with a box of odds and ends and cut the barrel of the scope about an inch and a half behind the objective bell, shaped the body so it had three legs and let light in and guess what, it worked. A minor victory for those of us that are challenged and not willing to put out money for the correct tool knowing that there's got to be a cheap and simple solution. Best part is it didn't take a week of searching for a solution.
The signature in script is as follows; ARous/sfron or sfror
Shed any light on this Geoffroy?
Thanks
Doc
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Charlin Grading/First post
